Chinese food in China; not as good as expected

[Gaijin 06]

I can't agree at all with the OP. I love Chinese food, and ate it almost exclusively in Hong Kong over the last couple of years.

However when I went to Shanghai both the price and relative quality of the food was fantastic. Could eat all my Shanghaiese favourites for 20% of the (already cheap) cost in Hong Kong... mmmm I am salivating just thinking about it.

But back to the topic at hand, I've found Chinese food is best served in China. Maybe the OP prefers Westernised versions of the dishes, which is why he thinks Belgian Chinese food is better?

[Maciamo]

But back to the topic at hand, I've found Chinese food is best served in China. Maybe the OP prefers Westernised versions of the dishes, which is why he thinks Belgian Chinese food is better?

Just wondering, which Chinese restaurants have you tried in Belgium to disagree with me ?

It's also fairly difficult to compared Westernised Chinese food in different countries. For example, the ones I tried in Hawaii (China Town, Alamohana Centre, Waikiki) were all quite disgusting (the worst Chinese food I have had so far). Non-Westernised Chinese food outside China (like in Japan, Thailand, Malaysia or Singapore) was better than what I ate in China for the same price. All the Japanese in the group agreed that it was less good than in Japan - except for the one at 500 RMB (7500yen) per person. But even for this price is was not so exceptional, and my wife also agreed that we could eat much better in Tokyo (Japanese, French, Italian, Indian, Mexican...) for much cheaper. Yet, this restaurant was praised by Lonely Planet as Beijing's most elaborate Imperial cuisine. We went there mostly because the older Japanese men in the group constantly complained to the guide that Chinese food in China was not good. The same happened in Shanghai. The best restaurant I went to was M on the Bund, which is French-Italian food. Despite being one of the most reputed restaurant in town, it was just average by Belgo-French standard.

The Chinese food I ate in Italy and Spain was almost the same in every city (in both countries), and although better than in Hawaii, it was less good than in Belgium (similar level to Japan, although very different in style). Such restaurants are usually quite big, with the same stereotypically Chinese decoration, and usually empty. The Chinese restaurants I tried in France (mostly in the South) were also not remarkable, usually mixed with Vietnamese cooking (as there are many Vietnamese in France), and very different from those in Belgium or Australia. The best Chinese restaurants in Belgium have private rooms and revolving tables like in China and Japan, something I haven't seen in Southern Europe.

[Gaijin 06]

Just wondering, which Chinese restaurants have you tried in Belgium to disagree with me ?

You wrote

I have to say that I was rather disappointed. I tried all the main types of Chinese food : Shanghainese, Cantonese, Sichuanese, Pekinese, and Shangxinese. I had already been disappointed by Chinese food in Japan, compared to the one in Belgium and Australia (the two best I have eaten in average worldwide).

I wrote you may prefer Belgianized Chinese to real Chinese food. Not sure why I need to go to Belgium to draw that conclusion!

I found that the many of the "best" restaurants in Shanghai (and also in Hong Kong) didn't have great decor, didnt look especially clean or look too inviting to Westerners, but that's where you hit the sweet spot for price/quality ratio.

Maybe if you go with a Chinese person next time you would have a better experience.

[thomas]

Maybe if you go with a Chinese person next time you would have a better experience.

I concur. The best food I have had in Shanghai was at restaurants I would have missed without my Chinese friends. Will never forget the bear stew I had in one of my favourite places serving Harbin food close to Nanjing Lu, quite an experience.

I would like to add that for me price is part of the quality, as I consider the quality/price ratio. I also count the difference of GDP/capita, so a dish selling at 60 RMB (6 euro, 900yen) in China is basically the same price than a regular Chinese restaurant in Tokyo. Considering that salaries are about 10x lower in Beijing than Tokyo, 900yen in Beijing should be compared to a 9000yen dish in Tokyo. From this point of view, the food in China was very very overpriced.

Haven't been to Beijing yet, but the average price for a meal in Shanghai is around 10 to 15 RMB. Furthermore, the price difference between restaurants of lower and higher quality is not that large in fact, unless you dine at a 5 star hotel.

My most favourite place in Shanghai: Jade Garden close to Huai Hai Lu

=> http://www.jade388.com/

[Gaijin 06]

I concur. The best food I have had in Shanghai was at restaurants I would have missed without my Chinese friends.

.......

Haven't been to Beijing yet, but the average price for a meal in Shanghai is around 10 to 15 RMB.

Both of these are spot on matches for my experience. Most of the restaurants/eateries I liked the most didn't have English menus and I was frequently the only gweilo in there, attracting many stares.

My girlfriend & I are both very fond of our food, and we found we could almost make the price of the air fare from Hong Kong in food savings over a short break

[Maciamo]

I concur. The best food I have had in Shanghai was at restaurants I would have missed without my Chinese friends.

We had a Chinese guide during the whole trip - that's why I don't understand. In short, DON'T trust guides of H.I.S. tours ! What's more we ended up going to more scam souvenir shops (10x over the real price) than sightseeing. Next time, it will be 'flight-only' (well, maybe hotel too, if it's a good deal).

Haven't been to Beijing yet, but the average price for a meal in Shanghai is around 10 to 15 RMB. Furthermore, the price difference between restaurants of lower and higher quality is not that large in fact, unless you dine at a 5 star hotel.

All our meals were included in the tour, but I checked the menu on the wall, and the price in what looked like average family restaurants was between 40 and 80 RMB per dish (so probably over 100 RMB per person for a whole meal). According to the prices indicated in my Lonely Planet, that's normal for middle-range restaurants. Those at 10-15 RMB are the cheapest possible. Even in the "Cheap Eats" section, many still cost 30 to 40 per meal. Foreign food (Italian, French, India...) is typically over 100 RMB. The Fangshan restaurant I mentioned had menus between 100 and 500 RMB (without the drinks), which is normal for an upmarket restaurant in Beijing. A very tasty and copious meal (I couldn't even finish my dish, which never happens normally) at the Grand Hyatt Shanghai was 150 RMB per person. So it may be a bit cheaper in Shanghai.

[bossel]

DON'T trust guides of H.I.S. tours !

Always better to have some Chinese friends or acquaintances who can show you round, preferably from the place you visit (else you end up moving around for hours on a number of different buses to find your destination, happened in Beijing to us).

What's more we ended up going to more scam souvenir shops (10x over the real price) than sightseeing.

I think, pretty much all souvenir shops are like that, esp. for foreigners. Eg. if you want to buy postcards, never go to a shop. At tourist locations there are numerous poor people selling the same postcards much cheaper than at what you get them in a shop: 18 (or even more than 20) yuan for one pack in a shop, 5 yuan for 2 packs near the Forbidden City.

the price in what looked like average family restaurants was between 40 and 80 RMB per dish (so probably over 100 RMB per person for a whole meal).

40-80 seems a bit high for "average family restaurants", but it probably also depends on where you are.